A great opportunity for underrepresented devs

A fantastic opportunity - This is no strings grant between $3000 - $20000 for underrepresented developers to make puzzle games. The people involved have an incredibly deep love of puzzle games (eg Makers of The Witness, and Alan Hazelden from A Good Snowman is Hard to Build and Cosmic Express). I really can't emphasise enough how good an opportunity this is!

http://the-witness.net/news/2018/03/3450/

A non exhaustive list of what they are looking for:
* Women
* Trans or Gender non-binary
* LGBTQIA
* People of Color
* Not from North America, Europe or another western nation
* English is not your first language
* Disabled
* People with mental health issues

Given the spirit of it, I'm not sure how well this applies to the average Make Games user (ie English speaking, relatively affluent Caucasian male) but I know there are many members for who this could be a life changing career kickstart. Deadline is 23 April. Go go go!

Comments

  • This post is very insulting and very racist. I am very disappointed by makegamessa for not addressing such issues.

    for example
    " What is "people of color" ?
  • I think it's a cool opportunity, just wondering if the system can be worked.
    Like, I could ask my wife to apply, being a woman with English not her first language, and just build the game for her.
  • @TheCorinthian ...Perhaps the system can be worked, but then you'd be screwing an underrepresented person out of a potential opportunity :(

    @Skinnyboy Yeah, I don't think "people of color" is a great term. The creators of this program are from America, so I think what they're trying to say is that they want non-Europeans to apply, as people of European descent are a very large proportion of the game development scene over there (also the American industry is mostly male and mostly able bodied etc).

    In America "people of color" means anyone who they think isn't "white". "People of color" lumps together people from Africa, Asia, Native Americans and Oceania, anyone born with a tan really. The term "people of color" isn't meant as an insult, but the term doesn't make sense in other cultures where "whiteness" isn't such a strong concept or where "white" people don't dominate the economic opportunities.

    I think I can understand why you find it insulting @SkinnyBoy , I think the program implies some people need help while others don't. And lumping African people together with those with "mental health issues" or those that are "disable" isn't a compliment.

    PLEASE correct me if I'm misunderstanding why you feel insulted @SkinnyBoy (I definitely don't mean to insult you further)
  • I'm not sure what's insulting or racist about this. They want to give money (without strings attached) for making puzzle games to people that aren't English-speaking able-bodied cis-het white men in 1st world countries, because historically they have had all the opportunity and privilege, and they continue to dominate the industry. This seems like a good thing to me.

    Is the problem that the language is offending? That's a valid concern. I know the grant call for applications was run by multiple people that would have tried their best write a great call, but it's easy to make mistakes. So let's work to figure out how to represent opportunities like this in a way that doesn't offend, because, while this grant's deadline has passed, there will hopefully be other opportunities like this in the future. Given the aim of helping under-represented game developers, how do you think it could be phrased?
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    @SkinnyBoy Your response says to me you feel that it's unfair you don't fall within the eligibility criteria? Indeed, game dev from South Africa is hard - exclusion can feel like futher judgement that you don't deserve a leg up, which probably isn't true.

    Your response also makes me feel sad: Even if you are not eligible or take issue with the selection criteria, it still represented an amazing opportunity for someone who is. When I shared the post, I imagined how life changing it could be to someone living in a township - the prospect filled me with excitement on their behalf. Can you imagine the judgement they would feel about their own deservedness when your post is the first reply? Can you also imagine what it says about how welcoming our community is or how likely it is that we are here to help build each other up?
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    @TheFuntastic ... From what I understand, @SkinnyBoy isn't upset he isn't eligible.
  • @EvanGreenwood If that is the case I am happy to admit to my own blind-spots and apologise for the misreading. I would also be happy to relay feedback and suggestions on why the language is problematic.
  • Well underrepresentation is highly misunderstood by the privileged. Can I please pause for a moment and make example from chess.

    If you don't know anything about how chess is run in south africa, you would immediately think that the face of chess is "white" in south africa, but if you go and check the list of chessa members you would see that majority of chess players are "african". So why do people think that chess is largely played by white people in south africa? Well how professional chess is run, highly disadvantages black people from participating in professional tournaments. how so? well almost all Merit tournaments are held near where most white people live so tournaments are too far from black neighborhoods, 2 merit tournaments are held at night which is too risky for people to travel from the township because they might spend 2-3 hours on the road and the cause of fatique. 3 entry fees are very expensive for people who live in the township. We all the average income of household in the township vs those who live in the suburbs. Well after all this, how good are chess players from previously disadvantaged communities? The answer is that majority of south african chess masters are from previously disadvantaged communities. So how do we solve the perception issue? Easy, Reduce entry fees, make them R20 if possible, bring more merit tournaments to the township or organize centralized accommodation or transport. 3 do not make tournaments at night.

    So how does this compare to game development. Well People may think that people from previously disadvantaged communities do not make games because they have never played or seen their games. Well if you visit TUT(Tshwane university of technology) located at Soshanguve you will be amazed by how many people are making games there not because they want to make games but because they must at least pass 1-3 game programming modules to finish their qualification. So why most of them don't want to make games even though they have to pass a game dev module before they graduate. Well I do not exactly know the answer, but the problem might be similar to chess. No game jams in the township. No support for developers in the township. It might not be conducive for township developers to always travel to developers meets or jams for motivation because of economic crisis. And not because they cannot do games.

    I do not have a conclusion about this issue but being from previously disadvantaged myself and also black and I feel disrespected when I am grouped as a class of people who can vs those who cannot, I am not competing, I just wanna have fun and make game and encourage those who want to make games too. So I think this conversation does't need to end here, but would like to hear thoughts from other previously disadvantaged as I am not speaking for anyone else except myself. So I am willing to even do a google hangout if we should debate about the topic in a south african context.

    Thanks

    Thanked by 1EvanGreenwood
  • SkinnyBoy said:
    I do not have a conclusion about this issue but being from previously disadvantaged myself and also black and I feel disrespected when I am grouped as a class of people who can vs those who cannot, I am not competing, I just wanna have fun and make game and encourage those who want to make games too.
    I'm not sure I follow. Are you saying that you feel disrespected because this grant is meant for a subset of people that has a relative lack of privilege (and you are also part of)? This grant is not trying to imply that the target audience cannot make games, but quite the opposite - these under-represented devs can make awesome games, but given that they lack a lot of the opportunities/resources available to more privileged folks they haven't been able to make as many games or get as far with them. Similarly to the the chess example, it's not a question of ability, but a question of opportunity and resources and other forms of privilege. Giving out grants is one way to try improve this. Will it fix it? Probably not, but it can seriously help some people, and it doesn't hurt anyone

    I think it's important to note that this grant isn't targeted at South Africa specifically, it's an international grant, so it's almost certain that it doesn't fully take the nuance of the South African situation into context. I don't think that can be expected of such a grant. Can we do better locally? Yes, most certainly! But that doesn't diminish efforts like this grant.

    I'm sorry, I must be misunderstanding something, but after thoroughly reading your reply I'm still struggling to see why you feel this grant is racist and/or you feel offended by it. Is it because "people of color" is a term that offends you because it groups all non-white races together (a valid concern)? Or because you feel like the association with some of the other categories is offensive (as suggested by @EvenGreenwood)? Or something else? TBH, I'm not even sure if what offends you is the core idea of the grant (giving money to these groups of people), or whether it's the language and presentation of it?

    So I'm genuinely quite confused as to why you're offended, but I'm eager to try figure out why, so we can more effectively improve the under-representation issue in the industry, both locally and abroad. Thanks for taking the time and helping us with this!
  • SkinnyBoy said:
    No game jams in the township. No support for developers in the township. It might not be conducive for township developers to always travel to developers meets or jams for motivation because of economic crisis. And not because they cannot do games.
    If it helps, this describes Durban too.
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    @SkinnyBoy I get what you're saying, but like @roguecode said, there are tons of places that lack things like game jams and meetups.

    If I can give my 2c on the jam. We have a very similar jam here at the company I work at, except its aimed at school girls.
    Why school girls? We are a company of ~200 people, but have 5 female engineers.

    We know that every year we do this, there are a handful of girls that are leagues ahead of the others. They have already been exposed to coding at home or at a friends house, and they usually win. Thats OK. The other 95% of attendees have no idea that this is even possible for them to start exploring now. For whatever reason, people don't think letting girls (and in OP's case, other underrepresented groups) that they can learn how to make games on their own.

    While things like game jams and meetups are cool, a lot of people don't even know they happen, or where to look to see when they happen. This competition is just an awesome way for people who had no exposure to the game dev scene to be introduced to it.

    So yeah @SkinnyBoy, you would definitely be more skilled than most of these people. The organisers of this competition know that people like you will likely enter and stand a better chance of winning than some of the other underrepresented entrants. Like I mentioned before, this competition will be set up to let more people know they can make games and give them a safe introduction to it.
    Thanked by 1Asriele
  • I'm joining @francoisvn in saying that I'm struggling to understand why @skinnyboy is offended, I've read all his replies twice now. The only clarity is that he finds "person of colour" offensive, but I can't figure out why.

    He first sets out that chess is seen as a "white" activity (the implication being privileged), but then dispels that by noting that it is heavily led by "African" (I would rather say "black", as white people who are born and bred locally are indeed "African" too, but that's besides the point) people. Then outlines how chess can improve inclusivity for black people, but it has already been noted that it's already heavily black-involved?

    The second example seems to run along the same vein. And I don't see how they illustrate why "person of colour" in the original post is "racist".

    I'm not dismissing it, I'm trying to understand the sentiment, I think it's important to understand.
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    @Tuism and @Francoisvn I think @SkinnyBoy did spell out where he felt disrespected:
    SkinnyBoy said:
    I do not have a conclusion about this issue but being from previously disadvantaged myself and also black and I feel disrespected when I am grouped as a class of people who can vs those who cannot, I am not competing, I just wanna have fun and make game and encourage those who want to make games too.
    I'm not saying that I think the grant @Funtastic pointed to is a bad thing, but I can imagine why @SkinnyBoy could feel the way he does about the wording. (Though I am an advantaged person so his frustration is in a blind spot of mine, and I wouldn't see what he's saying without him pointing it out).

    @SkinnyBoy If you do get some input from other previously disadvantaged people, and have some ideas how to "improve the under-representation issue in the industry" in the South African context, I'd love to listen. I've got a lot of blindspots on this kind of problem, but maybe myself and this community can do some things to help.

    Your comments already make me think that organizing more daytime game events in Cape Town at the Khayelitcha Bandwidth Barn may be something to put energy into.
  • @EvanGreenwood after reading that quote of @SkinnyBoy's again I think I understand. Now, I'm going to try and say it back in an effort to make sure I've understood correctly:

    @SkinnyBoy, you think it's offensive to you that they think "you", along with other people who fit under those criterias, are "not as good"? You think their offer to help "you" and other people who fit those criteria are belittling you as a person?
  • Maybe giving the list as an exclusion list rather than inclusion would be less sensitive, problem with using inclusive lists in this scenario is that you are specifically mentioning disadvantaged groups that are somewhat stereotyped in society, which is precisely who they are looking for. These are typically marginalized groups in society, maybe they shouldn't be fingered like this.

    Maybe saying "We don't want able bodied straight white males that speak English as first language..." is more fitting.
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    critic said:

    Maybe saying "We don't want able bodied straight white males that speak English as first language..." is more fitting.
    People commented that on the website. That being said, the team behind the project have been really excellent and most sensitive in their communications. I feel they just took this approach to try to speak directly to groups. Talking specifically to groups , I think is a better way of acknowledging them than saying, yeah everyone who isn't white and male. I personally really liked the way they set everything up. The people who complained were people who were not sure whether they were really legible, so I understand that they would want to express that uncertainty.
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    @Asriele That's really great to hear from someone working with the program! (that the team running the program have been excellent towards you).
    Thanked by 1Asriele
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